#soylent | Logs for 2020-09-27

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[00:29:21] <guy_> Think I'll go to Sonic and get a Coney.
[00:35:14] -!- c0lo [c0lo!~7892de8c@zqs-646-162-243-166.static.vic.bigpond.net.au] has joined #soylent
[00:35:27] <c0lo> =submit https://www.abc.net.au
[00:35:30] <systemd> Submitting "Kathrin has been 'brainwashed' by a nation before"...
[00:35:52] <systemd> ✓ Sub-ccess! "03Kathrin Has Been 'Brainwashed' by a Nation Before" (81 paragraphs) -> https://soylentnews.org
[00:38:00] <guy_> Joe Biden got to the Senate 180 years ago!
[00:38:33] <guy_> https://bigleaguepolitics.com
[00:38:34] <systemd> ^ 03WATCH: Joe Biden Reads Teleprompter Incorrectly: "I Got to the Senate 180 Years Ago" - Big League Politics
[00:54:37] <guy_> https://www.lawenforcementtoday.com
[00:54:38] <systemd> ^ 03Anti-police protesters hit Hartford PD, angry because unhinged woman ended up being arrested
[00:57:14] <AzumaHazuki> What i like most about your links are their professionalism, even tone, and unbiased reporting
[01:02:05] <guy_> Yes, I do like the professional reporting.
[01:02:42] <guy_> It stands in stark contrast to CNN and the like
[01:03:23] <AzumaHazuki> not even a trace of irony...
[01:06:15] <guy_> Actually, no. Did you look at the body camera video of that arrest? How much more professional can you get?
[01:06:37] <guy_> Even the "victim" in the arrest admits she was being a stupid bitch, and apologizes to the cops
[01:06:58] <AzumaHazuki> and there goes another migratory goalpost
[01:07:11] <guy_> lawenforcementtoday may be biased, but I don't think they are editing body camera videos
[01:07:31] <guy_> I don't know about goal posts - what is your goal here?
[01:07:38] <guy_> it's certainly not to get to the truth
[01:07:41] <AzumaHazuki> you're interesting to watch, I'll give you that. i'd like to think it's mostly sunk cost fallacy, as you don't seem to be a born sociopath, rather an induced one
[01:09:51] <guy_> It's too late for me to move to Baltimore so I can vote for Kim Klacik
[01:11:09] <AzumaHazuki> it's never too late. don't let your dreams be dreams, as the shouty guy says
[01:11:47] <guy_> I suppose I should decide who the hell I'm voting for
[01:11:59] <guy_> https://www.ksla.com
[01:12:00] <systemd> ^ 03Little River County Ballot - Contested Races - March 3, 2020
[01:12:26] <guy_> primary, lol
[01:13:51] <AzumaHazuki> i mean definitely go to baltimore
[01:23:16] <guy_> Huh - green site has an article Estee Lauder is going to have a photo shoot on the space station
[01:23:24] <guy_> sounds half interesting maybe
[01:25:51] <Bytram> "Huh - green site has an article Estee Lauder is going to ... shoot ... the space station" ;^)
[01:26:04] <Bytram> that might be a bit more interesting!
[01:26:08] <Bytram> j/k
[01:26:22] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Rockets' Red Glare? Multiple Rocket Launches Coming Up this Week - https://sylnt.us - hope-for-good-weather
[01:26:26] <Bytram> time for some sleep; have a great night everybody.
[01:26:44] <Bytram> (unless you made other plans!)
[01:37:31] <guy_> LOL @ bytram
[01:37:36] <guy_> have a good night man
[01:38:16] <guy_> Oooooh - if you can't attack the woman directly, just eat her children!!!
[01:38:24] <guy_> https://www.lawenforcementtoday.com
[01:38:25] <systemd> ^ 03Leftists are already attacking the adopted children of Supreme Court nominee Amy Coney Barrett
[01:42:03] <lld> everything is political they say, so even the most cruel, most vicious actions are commendable, even obligatory
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[02:48:50] <nutherguy> NOW we get to the bottom of things: it's all Jill Stein's fault!
[02:48:57] <nutherguy> https://www.rt.com
[02:48:59] <systemd> ^ 03‘Atone!’ Democrats blame Jill Stein voters for Trump’s chance to appoint a 3rd Supreme Court justice
[02:49:31] * nutherguy enjoys the sight and sound of Democrat heads assssploding
[02:50:04] <nutherguy> next, they'll be blaming Johnson!
[02:50:59] <nutherguy> https://twitter.com
[02:51:00] <systemd> ^ 03Twitter ( https://mobile.twitter.com )
[02:52:09] -!- driveby [driveby!~amnesia@107.189.kz.ukr] has joined #soylent
[02:53:45] <driveby> https://www.youtube.com
[02:53:46] <systemd> ^ 03Is everything you thought about Vikings and the Viking Age wrong???
[02:54:53] <driveby> https://i.4pcdn.org
[02:55:37] <driveby> https://medium.com
[02:55:38] <systemd> ^ 03The Greatest Trick the Devil Ever Pulled Was Convincing the World God Didn’t Exist.
[02:59:28] <nutherguy> aristarchus
[02:59:43] <nutherguy> have you seen this one that proves how senile Creepy Joe is?
[02:59:48] <nutherguy> https://bigleaguepolitics.com
[02:59:49] <systemd> ^ 03WATCH: Joe Biden Reads Teleprompter Incorrectly: "I Got to the Senate 180 Years Ago" - Big League Politics
[03:07:22] <aristarchus> Who _are_ you?
[03:10:47] <AzumaHazuki> that's runaway
[03:11:13] <aristarchus> Why is he here?
[03:11:23] <AzumaHazuki> because he has a desperate need to troll people
[03:11:41] <AzumaHazuki> poor bastard...he's going to get some of what he thinks he wants
[03:18:30] * TheMightyBuzzard yawns
[03:18:30] * MrPlow flips a Skittle into TheMightyBuzzard's gaping mouth
[03:18:53] <TheMightyBuzzard> good thing i mostly want naps and good fishing
[03:20:06] <AzumaHazuki> yes. you're a fool, and like most fools you enjoy the simple things in life. you'll be happy so long as you keep your beak out of trouble
[03:20:11] <TheMightyBuzzard> even better if i can take a nap while i'm waiting on the good fishing.
[03:20:13] <aristarchus> =submit https://www.nytimes.com
[03:20:15] <systemd> Submitting "Opinion | Amy Coney Barrett and the New, Old Anti-Catholicism"...
[03:20:37] <systemd> ✓ Sub-ccess! "03Opinion | Amy Coney Barrett and the New, Old Anti-Catholicism" (21 paragraphs) -> https://soylentnews.org
[03:20:40] <TheMightyBuzzard> i'm pretty happy, you're pretty miserable. who's the fool again?
[03:20:55] <aristarchus> Who are you?
[03:21:02] <TheMightyBuzzard> batman
[03:21:23] <TheMightyBuzzard> or possibly spartacus, i forget
[03:22:04] <AzumaHazuki> that's no more to the point than that a drunk may be happier than a sober man
[03:22:29] <TheMightyBuzzard> which is why you're miserable
[03:22:45] <AzumaHazuki> hell, pigs are happy to wallow in shit and mud all day, right up until someone comes to disembowel them for slaughter
[03:22:53] <TheMightyBuzzard> and?
[03:23:07] <AzumaHazuki> so...think about the analogy a bit?
[03:23:47] <TheMightyBuzzard> you should do the same. you're choosing misery over happiness. knowingly. for no benefit of sufficient value, else you would not be miserable.
[03:24:03] <AzumaHazuki> look, i know you can't help it that your brain isn't wired for morals or social interaction. i don't hold that in itself againt you. just stop pretending you have anything germane to say about either
[03:24:14] * TheMightyBuzzard cackles
[03:24:17] <TheMightyBuzzard> you crack me up
[03:24:24] <AzumaHazuki> see the above few posts, yes
[03:24:39] <TheMightyBuzzard> can't philosophize your way out of a paper bag and have not a clue how bad you are at it.
[03:24:50] <AzumaHazuki> again: see the above few posts
[03:24:56] <aristarchus> Who are you, saying with your magical psychic powers, is miserable?
[03:24:59] <TheMightyBuzzard> the holes in your argument you could drive a truck through.
[03:25:17] <TheMightyBuzzard> aristarchus, the woman who's constantly angry
[03:25:21] <AzumaHazuki> a third time: see the above. you don't possess the cognitive tools necessary to make that judgment
[03:26:06] <TheMightyBuzzard> repeat it all you like. you need to protect your illusions of superiority or you have to realize that your misery is for no reason.
[03:26:28] <AzumaHazuki> i'm not superior, just different...though more adaptive certainly
[03:26:40] <TheMightyBuzzard> oh i know you're not
[03:26:58] <TheMightyBuzzard> you're not even more adaptive or you wouldn't be miserable
[03:27:14] <AzumaHazuki> those two aren't even orthogonal to one another
[03:27:30] <TheMightyBuzzard> untrue.
[03:27:36] <TheMightyBuzzard> do you need it spelled out how?
[03:27:40] <AzumaHazuki> that is bordering on word salad. it's definitely argument salad
[03:28:13] <AzumaHazuki> again: happiness for its own sake has no moral value good or bad. it's the context that matters. and you, as we've known for a long time now, do not have the tools to make moral judgments
[03:28:37] <TheMightyBuzzard> no, it has value in that it marks you as not being an idiot.
[03:28:53] <AzumaHazuki> in and of itself? nope. context dependent
[03:29:14] <TheMightyBuzzard> this context, parsey mcparsepants
[03:29:31] <AzumaHazuki> with every reply you keep underscoring how cognitively unequipped you are to be talking about these things. you can't even conceive of the necessary concepts
[03:29:36] <TheMightyBuzzard> pedantry don't win arguments
[03:29:45] * TheMightyBuzzard laughs
[03:29:46] <AzumaHazuki> oh, you had an argument?
[03:30:30] <TheMightyBuzzard> nah, you don't wanna hear it. you'd rather trade insults. if you heard it you'd be forced to dispute it even if you knew it was right.
[03:30:42] <TheMightyBuzzard> anything else would make your life until now pointless.
[03:30:43] <AzumaHazuki> somehow i doubt that...
[03:30:52] <AzumaHazuki> like, top to bottom.
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[03:31:25] <AzumaHazuki> also, why does there need to be a point-at-infinity?
[03:31:52] <TheMightyBuzzard> i'll give ya the gradeschool version so maybe you can grok a little bit of it: misery is a choice. it has no bearing on your actions unless you want it to, only on your personal happiness.
[03:32:20] -!- driveby [driveby!~amnesia@185.191.ugz.lit] has joined #soylent
[03:32:21] <AzumaHazuki> so i can take that as an invitation to come to your place, tie you down to a table, and start removing pieces of you with your own power tools?
[03:32:34] <AzumaHazuki> since after all, misery is a choice, and any sadness or anguish you feel would be your own decision?
[03:32:43] <TheMightyBuzzard> nah, but i wouldn't lose any sleep over having to shoot you if you did.
[03:32:59] <AzumaHazuki> just hypothetically, don't get your tailfeathers in a knot :)
[03:33:20] <TheMightyBuzzard> be out fishing the next day and enjoying myself. like i keep telling you, you can't make me angry.
[03:33:38] <AzumaHazuki> let's boil that down a bit: your argument (pfffft) is that misery is entirely a product of will, and no outside circumstance whatsoever can affect it save that you let it, no?
[03:33:48] <TheMightyBuzzard> yep, it's a choice
[03:34:23] <AzumaHazuki> and there is no situation at all, including torture to the brink of death, that would make you unhappy save that you yourself choose to be so?
[03:34:39] <aristarchus> Ohhhh, The Secret! (Rebranded "power of positive thinking" from the '70's!
[03:34:45] <TheMightyBuzzard> unless you're a nonsentient animal, in which case you're not the boss of your emotions.
[03:35:24] <TheMightyBuzzard> aristarchus, naw. more a bastardized zen thing.
[03:35:34] <AzumaHazuki> so you will tell me, with the closest thing to a straight face you are capable of, that even if I were burnng you alive from the extremities inward, you would not be unhappy, save that you chose to be
[03:35:42] <AzumaHazuki> that's...doubtful
[03:36:01] <AzumaHazuki> not even a kindergartener has that kind of false bravado
[03:36:02] <TheMightyBuzzard> AzumaHazuki, whatever gave you the impression that i thought i was perfect?
[03:36:18] <AzumaHazuki> what does that have to do with the central thesis here?
[03:36:38] <TheMightyBuzzard> think about it a moment. it's not exactly a hard leap.
[03:37:04] <AzumaHazuki> please, you construct these wobbly fallacious sandcastles and then dodge even the most softball questions
[03:37:06] <TheMightyBuzzard> see, this is what i mean when i say you're not equipped for philosophy
[03:37:17] <AzumaHazuki> one more time: will you really tell me, with the closest thing to a straight face you are capable of, that even if I were burnng you alive from the extremities inward, you would not be unhappy, save that you chose to be
[03:37:26] <TheMightyBuzzard> you can't follow even the simplest cause and effect reasoning
[03:37:37] <AzumaHazuki> remember, you have said that misery in ANY situation is entirely a choice
[03:37:42] <TheMightyBuzzard> again, what gave you the idea that i thought i was perfect?
[03:37:45] <AzumaHazuki> i am merely holding you to your exact words
[03:37:53] <aristarchus> =submit https://www.floridatoday.com
[03:37:55] <systemd> Submitting "ULA again delays Delta IV Heavy launch due to hardware issues at Cape Canaveral"...
[03:38:17] <systemd> ✓ Sub-ccess! "03ULA Again Delays Delta IV Heavy Launch Due to Hardware Issues at Cape Canaveral" (0 paragraphs) -> https://soylentnews.org
[03:38:31] <TheMightyBuzzard> if you can't even make that leap, talking to you is pointless. most teenagers i philosophize with are better at this.
[03:38:47] <AzumaHazuki> hey, you're the one making absolute statements here
[03:38:55] <TheMightyBuzzard> which are absolutely true
[03:38:56] <AzumaHazuki> if you mean to qualify them, do so
[03:39:06] <aristarchus> If you do not know the difference between "sentient" and "sapient", there really is no point in arguing with you, Mr. Buzzard.
[03:39:06] <TheMightyBuzzard> without exception
[03:39:12] <TheMightyBuzzard> they are perfect, i am not.
[03:39:36] <AzumaHazuki> so the imperfection lies where, in this hypothetical scenario? that you would, in a moment of weakness, choose to be unhappy?
[03:39:51] <TheMightyBuzzard> light dawns on marble head
[03:40:07] <AzumaHazuki> come on now, that was the first eye-rolling "rebuttal" i thought of
[03:40:19] <AzumaHazuki> it's completely empty. but it reveals a surprising amount you might not expect about you
[03:40:39] <TheMightyBuzzard> my own failure at perfection does not change the truth or my approach
[03:41:05] <AzumaHazuki> this does reveal your complete lack of biological and psychological knowledge then
[03:41:10] * TheMightyBuzzard laughs
[03:41:24] <AzumaHazuki> stretch an orgnamism past its breaking point and no amount of "will" means anything
[03:41:33] <TheMightyBuzzard> you're stupid? really? that's your argument?
[03:41:52] <AzumaHazuki> you are not a hero. you are not a badass. you are not the kung-fu hippie from gangsta city (that's Poochie and he died on the way home)
[03:41:56] <TheMightyBuzzard> breaking points are a matter of will.
[03:42:35] <AzumaHazuki> then at the very most charitable this argument of yours is along the lines of debating hard solipsism or hard determinism
[03:43:10] <TheMightyBuzzard> your insults roll off my back like water off a duck yet you keep going with them. einstein's definition of insanity in action?
[03:43:24] <AzumaHazuki> i find this sort of thinking fairly common among autistic and ADHD people though. not an insult, just an observation
[03:43:51] <TheMightyBuzzard> my argument is your mind does what you tell it. if it doesn't you are not a reasoning being, you just have the illusion of such.
[03:44:13] <AzumaHazuki> finally. there's the 64,000 dollar quote
[03:44:28] <AzumaHazuki> now try that one on any neurobiologist :) tell me how many laughs you get
[03:44:32] <TheMightyBuzzard> yours says otherwise, which is completely understandable with your pathological need to blame someone else.
[03:44:52] <AzumaHazuki> whooooa, there, pardner. movie theaters aren't open yet, put the projector down
[03:45:07] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Crows Possess Higher Intelligence Long Thought Primarily Human - https://sylnt.us - bird-brains
[03:45:08] <driveby> https://www.unz.com
[03:45:10] <systemd> ^ 03The world has gone absolutely insane!
[03:45:14] <TheMightyBuzzard> what do i blame you for, exactly?
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[03:45:43] <AzumaHazuki> you have made a testable, falsifiable claim. your position on this claim places you in direct conflict with people orders of magnitude more informed on the subject than you. this is not an argument to authority, rather to evidence
[03:45:59] <AzumaHazuki> you know little or nothing of the systems of which you speak\\
[03:46:08] * TheMightyBuzzard laughs
[03:46:25] <TheMightyBuzzard> prove it or it absolutely is an argument to authority
[03:47:25] <aristarchus> The first Noble Truth of Buddhism is that existence is suffering. Dukkha.
[03:48:10] <TheMightyBuzzard> and? i wake up every day with a little more pain than the day before. and still i choose to be happy.
[03:48:59] <TheMightyBuzzard> not perfectly happy, just on the plus side of meh
[03:50:01] * nutherguy hopes that Buzzard finds a sentient progressive to discuss philosophy with
[03:50:12] <aristarchus> Second Noble Truth: Suffering has a cause.
[03:50:19] <TheMightyBuzzard> no such thing. they're post-truth.
[03:50:30] <TheMightyBuzzard> aristarchus, and?
[03:50:39] <AzumaHazuki> this needs tea, putting the kettle on
[03:50:44] <AzumaHazuki> this is...hilarious
[03:51:48] <aristarchus> Now, this is the hard part: suffering is caused by desire, both the desire for happiness, and the desire to avoid pain and misery. Both of those are causes of suffering
[03:52:05] <TheMightyBuzzard> aristarchus, that's where ole sid was dead wrong.
[03:52:07] * nutherguy hates happy
[03:52:11] <AzumaHazuki> aristarchus: just a reminder, you're not dealing with the kind of mind here that has any truck with spiritual things, even if they *are* basically philosophy
[03:52:26] <AzumaHazuki> this guy's not capable of it. he's a walking mass of appetites
[03:52:46] <TheMightyBuzzard> happiness is a choice not something you find externally. look for happiness from external sources and that's completely accurate though.
[03:53:17] <AzumaHazuki> yes and no. happiness is a result of choices you may make within an environment which includes the state of your body and mind
[03:53:30] <TheMightyBuzzard> but it marks you as fundamentally flawed in your thinking.
[03:53:41] <AzumaHazuki> you do not exist in vacuum. your mind is not a separate, Platonic form apart from the rest of reality
[03:54:02] <TheMightyBuzzard> yes, it is. nobody else gets to think thoughts for me.
[03:54:02] <AzumaHazuki> this is the crux of your cognitive misfiring...and a very odd one, coming from such an avowed materialist
[03:54:16] <nutherguy> ???????????
[03:54:20] <AzumaHazuki> oh, your mind is separate from other minds, no mistake there
[03:54:33] <nutherguy> Is TMB a materialist?
[03:54:37] <AzumaHazuki> hell, i'd say most of the time even you don't think thoughts for you
[03:54:50] <TheMightyBuzzard> nutherguy, yep. mostly carbon, hydrogen, and oxygen.
[03:55:06] <nutherguy> ahhhhhh - not quite like the Material Girl then
[03:55:12] <AzumaHazuki> that is a bizarrely dualist, to say almost theistic, mistake for a materialist to make
[03:55:22] <aristarchus> Buddhism is an atheist religion. There are only mythological spiritual things.
[03:55:29] <TheMightyBuzzard> AzumaHazuki, external stimuli do not necessitate a specific response from you. if they do you are a machine not a conscious, rational being.
[03:55:48] <AzumaHazuki> i sense a fear of being anything less than 100% in control...dukkha :)
[03:55:51] <aristarchus> Third noble truth: there can be an end to suffering.
[03:55:56] <TheMightyBuzzard> nutherguy, well diamonds are carbon but i'm not a girl so they're not my best friend.
[03:56:18] <AzumaHazuki> the prospect of 'separation from that which is pleasing," in this case, the idea that you are not a sack of meat and dirty water
[03:56:19] * nutherguy was thinking of some shallow wench called Madonna
[03:56:35] * TheMightyBuzzard shurgs
[03:56:46] <TheMightyBuzzard> you gotta put forth a decent argument if you want to make that claim
[03:56:53] <AzumaHazuki> far less of you is under your conscious control than you think. this is why i say any neurobiologist or neurologist would laugh themselves hoarse at your arguments
[03:57:18] <aristarchus> The cessation of suffering is the cessation of desire, of attachment. So you gotta stop bragging about how happy you are, Buzz. Sounds attached, and desparate.
[03:57:18] <AzumaHazuki> and yet, you remain entirely ignorant of these things, and dismiss it as "argument to authority." you are deeply invested in this idea
[03:57:28] * nutherguy believes that neurobioligists and neurologists should be kept in a horse stall
[03:57:32] <TheMightyBuzzard> that's a choice. anything short of biological functions you can change.
[03:57:47] <AzumaHazuki> and here we go again...
[03:57:47] <TheMightyBuzzard> you offer no evidence, only authority
[03:58:27] <AzumaHazuki> for a start, investigate split-brain patients
[03:58:31] <TheMightyBuzzard> if you want your argument to not be dismissed as $bloodystupidreason, don't make bloody stupid arguments.
[03:58:46] <aristarchus> We have been over this before, Buzzard, and you don't get it. But imagine, for a second. What is happy? The happy thing?
[03:59:10] <AzumaHazuki> they are only "bloody stupud" to those who willfully refuse to understand them and do the due diligence to :) you are fixated on rejecting all outside evidence
[03:59:31] <TheMightyBuzzard> no, they are bloody stupid when you point out the fallacy that you are claiming to not be using
[03:59:36] <nutherguy> Yes, "If you don't understand me, it's because you are willfully stupid!"
[03:59:37] <TheMightyBuzzard> but absolutely are
[03:59:41] <AzumaHazuki> a five year old might think dietary science is bloody stupid because he wants that extra cookie, but what of it?
[03:59:53] <aristarchus> What makes you a thing that can be happy is the desire. And of course, this desire will cause suffering. Two tragedies in life, never getting what you want, and getting what you want.
[04:00:26] <TheMightyBuzzard> dietary science is bloody stupid. or at least quite shitty. it changes every few years, often saying the exact opposite of what it said a few years ago.
[04:00:36] <TheMightyBuzzard> but i don't want a cookie
[04:01:01] <nutherguy> I wanted hot cakes a little bit ago - now I'm content
[04:01:06] <TheMightyBuzzard> aristarchus, you don't need desire to be happy. desires can be post-hoc.
[04:01:07] <nutherguy> not to be confused with "happy"
[04:01:18] <aristarchus> Problem with arguing with birds: super short attention spans. Look! Shiny!
[04:01:33] <AzumaHazuki> this is like trying to explain "red" to the colorblind...
[04:01:34] <TheMightyBuzzard> nutherguy, pancakes fill you up too much to be happy
[04:01:35] <nutherguy> aristarchus needs to read the article on crows
[04:02:00] <aristarchus> Not the desire, the having of desires, or even of the feeling of happiness you were claiming.
[04:02:15] <nutherguy> scientists have proven that corvids are smarter than artistarchuses
[04:02:39] <TheMightyBuzzard> AzumaHazuki, i see me shooting down every last argument from TWO of you in defending my position. someone here is definitely delusional but it ain't me.
[04:02:39] <AzumaHazuki> hush, runaway, the adults are doing the bird a 'splain
[04:02:52] <AzumaHazuki> yeah, we know you *see* that. doesn't make it the truth
[04:03:04] <nutherguy> figures, 'zumi doing some birdsplainin
[04:03:05] <AzumaHazuki> any more than a lunatic writing "darkness" on his cell wall blows out the sun
[04:03:11] <TheMightyBuzzard> yes, it absolutely does. you never answer my points, you dodge them.
[04:03:31] <AzumaHazuki> you aren't even capable of understanding mine or meeting them on their own turf
[04:03:40] <TheMightyBuzzard> rhetorical tricks are a damned fine indicator that you are not competent to make your argument
[04:03:40] <AzumaHazuki> that's like saying you win a chess game by now showing up
[04:03:46] <AzumaHazuki> not*
[04:03:58] <nutherguy> no winning move?
[04:04:06] <TheMightyBuzzard> nutherguy, shall we play a game?
[04:04:10] <nutherguy> lol
[04:04:28] <nutherguy> thermonuclear warfare FTW
[04:04:30] <AzumaHazuki> we've zeroed in on the weakness here: you steadfastly refuse any evidence that could possibly upset your current worldview, dismissing it as "argument to authority." there is no discourse with such a one; i may as well be giving medicine to a corpse
[04:04:35] <AzumaHazuki> how then do you claim to be arguing?
[04:04:47] <TheMightyBuzzard> you've offered no evidence
[04:04:53] <TheMightyBuzzard> like none
[04:04:55] <AzumaHazuki> the modern term for this is "pigeon chess."
[04:05:04] <TheMightyBuzzard> not even a decent bit of logic.
[04:05:16] <TheMightyBuzzard> not even flawed logic.
[04:05:27] <AzumaHazuki> you lack the preconditions to argue these things. i am explaining sound to a man born deaf
[04:05:46] <AzumaHazuki> and you are telling me that there is no such thing as sound
[04:05:56] <nutherguy> I posit that if you haven't walked 100 miles in 'zumis shoes, you can't understand her
[04:05:57] <TheMightyBuzzard> half your statements are "you're dumb" put more verbosely. if that's the best you can do, you lost this debate.
[04:06:10] <aristarchus> The assumption of substance is what is in question. For there to exist "happiness", you are assuming that there is something, namely "you", that is happy.
[04:06:11] <TheMightyBuzzard> nutherguy, i could walk five hundred miles
[04:06:12] <AzumaHazuki> well, you are dumb. but that in itself isn't a disqualifier
[04:06:24] <AzumaHazuki> your problem is refusing to get not-dumb
[04:06:32] <nutherguy> in her shoes? You'll get blisters in over sized boots!
[04:06:49] <TheMightyBuzzard> aristarchus, well *someone's* butt stopps itching when i scratch it. if it's not me then i'm in trouble.
[04:07:09] <aristarchus> Not so much anyone calling you "stupid" as your inability to comprehend a point being made!
[04:07:13] <AzumaHazuki> ari, er...this guy probably isn't in the right headspace to grasp the idea of anatman
[04:07:25] <TheMightyBuzzard> AzumaHazuki, when you don't make an actual argument aside from that and claiming evidence without presenting any? yeah, i ain't the dumb one.
[04:07:30] <nutherguy> How can you talk about Max Headroom like that?
[04:07:59] <AzumaHazuki> it's not my problem if you lack the willingness to examine the evidence and just dismiss it out of hand
[04:08:06] * TheMightyBuzzard has all of that in on the media server
[04:08:09] <TheMightyBuzzard> really should watch it
[04:08:18] <aristarchus> So, Buddhism is turning this all around, and saying that the "happiness" is what creates the illusion of something "having" the feeling of happiness. There is nonesuch.
[04:08:21] <TheMightyBuzzard> AzumaHazuki, present an argument if you want to win.
[04:08:54] <TheMightyBuzzard> you have to actually do that if you want to claim i'm ignoring it.
[04:08:56] <AzumaHazuki> as soon as you're able to understand and willing to engage with it. this is complicated stuff and requires some neuroscience background, but you refuse to learn it...sooooo
[04:09:10] <AzumaHazuki> a good place to start is the split-brain patient literature
[04:09:11] * TheMightyBuzzard laughs
[04:09:15] <TheMightyBuzzard> excuses excuses
[04:09:23] <nutherguy> jesus christ, how many times have we heard that non-argument?
[04:09:32] <aristarchus> =submit https://www.thesun.co.uk
[04:09:34] <systemd> Submitting "What is the alt-right group the Proud Boys?"...
[04:09:42] <AzumaHazuki> running a marathon requires working legs. if you refuse to exist below the waist, how can I ask you to run one?
[04:09:52] <TheMightyBuzzard> AzumaHazuki, that's ablist!
[04:09:56] <systemd> aristarchus, 04submit failed: Rehash error: "Failed to create submission"
[04:10:00] <nutherguy> I get my kicks ABOVE the waist, Sunshine
[04:10:20] <TheMightyBuzzard> nutherguy, i'm barely flexible enough for that anymore
[04:10:21] <AzumaHazuki> yeah, we know nothing below has worked for decades 9_9
[04:10:41] <aristarchus> There is nothing that is you, since all phenomena are empty, or transient, non-substantial. This is the doctrine of sunyata.
[04:10:44] <AzumaHazuki> you need some background in neurology and brain function before what i'm saying is going to make sense, Buzzard. If you're not willing to do the needful, that's on you, not me. I never said this would be easy
[04:10:44] <nutherguy> no, you can't have any of that 'zumi, no matter how many times you hint and beg
[04:10:47] <TheMightyBuzzard> i mean i could break a few ribs but not a jaw anymore
[04:11:00] <TheMightyBuzzard> AzumaHazuki, make the arguments and let me worry about my end.
[04:11:16] <AzumaHazuki> think of it as a particularly knotty code problem if it helps, something to be conquered and understood
[04:11:25] <TheMightyBuzzard> no? can't? yeah, thought not.
[04:11:46] <nutherguy> Maybe Mohammed had the right idea
[04:11:48] <AzumaHazuki> already did, beaky. again: not my problem if it's too rich for your blood
[04:11:53] <nutherguy> kill all the philosophers
[04:12:02] <TheMightyBuzzard> thought he wanted to kill the jews
[04:12:12] <aristarchus> =submit https://www.forbes.com
[04:12:14] <systemd> Submitting "Who Are The Proud Boys, The Group Planning A Controversial Portland Rally?"...
[04:12:15] <nutherguy> philosophers too, they talked to much for him
[04:12:36] <systemd> ✓ Sub-ccess! "03Who are the Proud Boys, the Group Planning a Controversial Portland Rally?" (14 paragraphs) -> https://soylentnews.org
[04:12:39] <TheMightyBuzzard> no, you said read a book, insluted me, appealed to authority, and claimed to present an argument. you presented no actual arguments or evidence.
[04:12:41] <nutherguy> the Portland protest is no longer planned Aristarchus - it is history
[04:13:15] <AzumaHazuki> hey, i can't help it if you wall out any evidence. "Show me evidence!" "Here, read about this" "THAT'S NOT EVIDENE DERKADURRR YOU DON'T GIMME EVIDENCE HURRRR"
[04:13:22] <TheMightyBuzzard> man, that guy wanted to kill everyone. he needed to fish more.
[04:13:36] <aristarchus> As Haruki menitioned, this is the teaching of anatman, that there is no soul, no self, and your own existence is only a delusion of attachment that will cause you to have bad fishing days.
[04:13:37] <TheMightyBuzzard> never said any such thing. lies now?
[04:13:38] <nutherguy> agreed - Jesus fished a lot
[04:13:44] <TheMightyBuzzard> you really suck at this arguing
[04:13:50] <AzumaHazuki> bad fishing days, LOL
[04:13:54] <TheMightyBuzzard> thought he was a carpenter
[04:14:06] <TheMightyBuzzard> speaking of, what'd he say when he hit his thumb with a hammer?
[04:14:14] <nutherguy> like a lot of us carpenters, he did other stuff too
[04:14:28] <AzumaHazuki> even i don't completely grok anatman, and I'm not sure it's entirely true. he seems to be saying there's no atman as in the Hindu idea of an immortal, self-existent soul, rather than "there is no self at all period"
[04:14:37] <aristarchus> And even the good fishing days will cause you suffering, since they will soon be over, and this is a cause of pain.
[04:14:59] <nutherguy> But pain lets you know that you are still alive
[04:15:07] <nutherguy> no pain, no gain
[04:15:15] <TheMightyBuzzard> aristarchus, wrong perspective. bad fishing days only make the good ones sweeter.
[04:15:30] <TheMightyBuzzard> they're the baseline not negative.
[04:16:08] <TheMightyBuzzard> and even a bad day fishing is better than a good day at work.
[04:16:24] <TheMightyBuzzard> nutherguy, pain is a sign of weakness leaving the body
[04:16:31] <nutherguy> uh-huh
[04:16:44] <aristarchus> Always the scientist, the self is a assembly of what the Buddhists refer to as skandhas, but you might think of as a functioning nervous system. But once it ceases to function, there is no more self? So Buzzie's command theory of happiness is crock.
[04:17:09] <AzumaHazuki> it was crock even if you just consider the neuroscience...which he refuses to do
[04:17:10] <TheMightyBuzzard> AzumaHazuki, i think we're done here. when you actually become competent to argue philosophy feel free to try again. you haven't argued it yet though, only dodged.
[04:17:22] <AzumaHazuki> that. is...amazing
[04:17:43] <AzumaHazuki> well, if it makes you happy to think that way, sure, refusing to show up for the game isn't technically a loss *shrug
[04:17:55] <TheMightyBuzzard> aristarchus, i don't wear crocks. boots, vans, or flip-flops
[04:18:18] * nutherguy checks the game schedule
[04:18:28] <AzumaHazuki> whistling in your own darkness, trying to smartass your way around your own ignorance. some part of you must know how tiny and ill-equipped you are
[04:18:40] <nutherguy> There was no game scheduled, all you've done is toss the ball at the basket and miss every time
[04:18:51] <AzumaHazuki> well, that's your right. just don't say I didn't warn you on the other side, okay...?
[04:19:16] <TheMightyBuzzard> AzumaHazuki, i've shot down every argument you tried to make. though they were few and far between with all the rhetorical nonsense you think constitutes arguing.
[04:19:30] <AzumaHazuki> this is the kind of shit the buddhists ari's talking about say gets you reborn as an animal or a pretan/hungry ghost
[04:19:30] <aristarchus> Yes, enough for now. Time for me to go fight the forces of evil and stupidity, and *guy*s, with sparkling submissions! Tootles!
[04:19:40] * TheMightyBuzzard waves at aristarchus
[04:19:56] <nutherguy> lol, sparkling
[04:20:08] <TheMightyBuzzard> thermite sparkles
[04:20:20] <AzumaHazuki> compared to your drooling parkinson's-addled QAnon bullshit? definitely sparkling
[04:20:30] <nutherguy> I suppose that when the sun shines on a ball of dung, the dung beetle sees sparkles too
[04:20:32] <TheMightyBuzzard> anyway, ima go read the spiderman novel jim butcher wrote this year or was it last year?
[04:20:39] * TheMightyBuzzard rolls laughing
[04:20:53] <TheMightyBuzzard> QAnon? weak shit.
[04:21:09] <AzumaHazuki> yeah, it really is...and yet, he keeps posting stuff from that mindspace sooo
[04:21:24] <TheMightyBuzzard> no, i mean you're really sucking at this arguing stuff tonight. worse than usual.
[04:21:40] -!- aristarchus has quit []
[04:22:11] <TheMightyBuzzard> nicotine++ #and also spiderman
[04:22:11] <Bender> karma - nicotine: 786
[04:22:11] <AzumaHazuki> keep telling yourself that if it makes you happy i guess :/
[04:22:16] * nutherguy wanders off to mess with an FRP lock
[04:22:42] <AzumaHazuki> just, what a shame, throwing away a human lifetime like this
[04:43:51] <nutherguy> https://babylonbee.com
[04:43:52] <systemd> ^ 03Genius Trump Nominates Joe Biden To Supreme Court Forcing Dems To Accuse Him Of Sexual Assault
[04:49:57] <nutherguy> !grab AzumaHazuki
[04:50:22] <AzumaHazuki> not even if you had a thousand lifetimes
[04:50:30] <AzumaHazuki> your hands would burn at the touch
[04:50:33] <nutherguy> stupid bod
[04:50:36] <nutherguy> bot
[04:50:48] <nutherguy> I know, there's water in my hands
[04:50:59] <AzumaHazuki> oh don't blame the bot
[04:51:04] <nutherguy> Ruth Bader met HER bucket of water
[04:52:14] <nutherguy> It is good just to have seen you lamenting the waste you call a life, even if I couldn't capture the quote
[04:52:14] <AzumaHazuki> she did her country and its people proud. yes, even you
[04:53:14] <AzumaHazuki> and in case you're really that stupid, "what a waste of a human life" refers to Buzztard spending his doing nothing more than satiating his animal desires. that's just incomprehensible to me
[04:53:55] <AzumaHazuki> what's even the point of being a sapient if that's how you're going to live? may as well just be a pig in a paddock somewhere
[05:14:05] <nutherguy> better to be a honey badger than a pig, but whatever
[05:19:43] <nutherguy> https://www.youtube.com
[05:19:44] <systemd> ^ 03Python, Honey Badger & Jackal Fight Each Other
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[06:06:08] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - When Coffee Makers are Demanding a Ransom, You Know IoT is Screwed - https://sylnt.us - all-your-beans-are-belong-to-us
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[07:03:19] <chromas> Aw, I missed the circlejerk
[07:07:15] <TheMightyBuzzard> s'okay, we saved you the cookie
[08:27:58] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Physicists Develop a Method to Improve Gravitational Wave Detector Sensitivity - https://sylnt.us - massive-effort
[08:35:09] <FatPhil> you're all gonna get kicked!
[09:21:23] <FatPhil> If you don't support Barrett, you hate women!
[10:22:56] -!- c0lo [c0lo!~7892de8c@zqs-646-162-243-166.static.vic.bigpond.net.au] has joined #soylent
[10:23:07] <c0lo> =submit https://www.abc.net.au
[10:23:10] <systemd> Submitting "'You will be put into detention': Former ABC bureau chief tells story of fleeing China for first time - ABC News"...
[10:23:32] <systemd> ✓* Sub-ccess! "08'You Will be Put Into Detention': Former ABC Bureau Chief Tells Story of Fleeing China for First Tim" (100 paragraphs) -> https://soylentnews.org
[10:47:43] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - New Composite Material Revs Up Pursuit of Advanced Electric Vehicles - https://sylnt.us - nanotubes++
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[13:17:38] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Astronauts are Getting a New Toilet Next Week - https://sylnt.us - boldly-going
[13:31:00] <RandomFactor> Chromas - yeah, me too. Just catching up.
[13:31:26] <RandomFactor> Although TBH i wouldn't have just played distractor like usual.
[13:33:14] * Bytram has been looking around at spacex's twitter feed and youtube channel -- can't find a link to upcoming launch.
[13:34:14] * Bytram realizes that is not until *tomorrow* morning which might explain things.
[13:44:24] <RandomFactor> s/wouldn't/would/
[13:44:39] * RandomFactor honestly knew it wouldn't work in advance
[13:58:42] <RandomFactor> =submit Fried Eggs and Bacillus https://www.sciencealert.com
[13:58:43] <systemd> Submitting "First Compelling Evidence of Organisms That Eat Viruses as a Food Source"...
[13:59:05] <systemd> ✓ Sub-ccess! "03First Compelling Evidence of Organisms That Eat Viruses as a Food Source" (27 paragraphs) -> https://soylentnews.org
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[15:36:09] <FatPhil> =submit https://www.euronews.com
[15:36:11] <systemd> Submitting "'Corona dogs' deployed at Helsinki airport to sniff out COVID-19"...
[15:36:23] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Black Doctors Have Created a Task Force to Make Sure COVID-19 Vaccines are Safe - https://sylnt.us
[15:36:33] <systemd> ✓ Sub-ccess! "03'Corona Dogs' Deployed at Helsinki Airport to Sniff Out COVID-19" (10 paragraphs) -> https://soylentnews.org
[16:26:09] <nutherguy> corona dogs - isn't that a coney with a beer?
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[17:58:11] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - President Trump Nominates Amy Coney Barrett to the US Supreme Court; Senate Battle Looms - https://sylnt.us - hypocrisy
[18:47:04] <halibut> https://www.seanrheavey.com Ignore the copyright date. It feels like Sean Heavey briefly travelled forward in time from 2010 to later this year to take this picture. This would be a great addition to the ``this is 2020'' meme.
[18:47:05] <systemd> ^ 03OLD -Sky, Clouds, and the World Above
[18:48:15] <halibut> Another version: https://apod.nasa.gov
[18:48:16] <systemd> ^ 03APOD: 2010 November 30 - A Supercell Thunderstorm Cloud Over Montana
[19:05:41] SoyGuest89764 is now known as cosurgi
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[19:05:45] -!- mode/#soylent [+v cosurgi] by Aphrodite
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[19:11:27] <chromas> test
[19:11:31] <chromas> s/./test/g
[19:11:32] <SedBot> <chromas> testtesttesttest
[19:38:40] <requerdanos> ths
[19:38:46] <requerdanos> s/th/thi/g
[19:38:46] <SedBot> <requerdanos> this
[20:17:09] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - An Aurora that Lit Up the Sky Over the Titanic Might Explain Why It Sank - https://sylnt.us - vatch-das-blinkenlights
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[21:27:09] <FatPhil> /Feels Good Man/ was not a bad documentary.
[22:17:13] <FatPhil> never heard of PepeCash before. Looks like the guy with the Lambo cashed out at the right time: https://coinmarketcap.com
[22:17:14] <systemd> ^ 03Pepe Cash price today, PEPECASH marketcap, chart, and info
[22:47:29] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Hitting the Books: the Invisible Threat that Every ISS Astronaut Fears - https://sylnt.us - saving-your-skin
[22:52:52] -!- arti|work has quit [Quit: My Mac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…]
[23:08:53] * RandomFactor pokes at sedbot with a stick
[23:09:05] <RandomFactor> 180 score and seven years ago
[23:09:14] <RandomFactor> s/180/Four/
[23:09:14] <SedBot> <RandomFactor> Four score and seven years ago
[23:10:03] <requerdanos> bot madness
[23:10:11] <requerdanos> s/^/Amazing\ /g
[23:10:11] <SedBot> <requerdanos> Amazing bot madness
[23:13:35] <requerdanos> s/bot/sed\ bot/g
[23:13:35] <SedBot> <requerdanos> sed bot madness
[23:14:42] -!- AzumaHazuki [AzumaHazuki!~hazuki@the.end.of.time] has joined #soylent
[23:17:37] <RandomFactor> Ice Ice Baby
[23:17:41] <AzumaHazuki> too cold, too cold
[23:17:53] <RandomFactor> s/ice/cream//2
[23:18:00] * RandomFactor frets
[23:18:12] <RandomFactor> oh case
[23:18:15] <RandomFactor> Ice Ice Baby
[23:18:21] <requerdanos> s#bot#alternate\ syntax#g
[23:18:21] <SedBot> <requerdanos> alternate syntax madness
[23:18:26] <RandomFactor> s/Ice/cream//2
[23:18:29] <RandomFactor> narp
[23:19:41] <RandomFactor> @sedbot help
[23:20:01] <RandomFactor> hmmm
[23:20:09] <RandomFactor> s help
[23:20:57] <AzumaHazuki> it's so cold it's frozen :v
[23:21:11] <RandomFactor> s/help/halp!/
[23:21:11] <SedBot> <RandomFactor> s halp!
[23:21:18] <RandomFactor> narp
[23:21:26] <RandomFactor> it's just....limited
[23:21:36] <RandomFactor> prob due to narapoid coders
[23:21:59] <requerdanos> sed is pretty advanced, whereas sedbot probably is less so
[23:22:18] <RandomFactor> Dah komrad
[23:24:56] <RandomFactor> s/RandomFactor/RandomFactorIsAwesome!/
[23:25:02] <RandomFactor> definitely limited
[23:27:52] <nutherguy> Will Pepe and sedbot eat from the same food bowl?
[23:28:25] <chromas> You had an extra slash before
[23:28:32] <chromas> Ice Ice Baby
[23:28:35] <chromas> s/Ice/cream/2
[23:28:35] <SedBot> <chromas> Ice cream Baby
[23:28:54] <RandomFactor> <---Syntactically challenged
[23:29:19] <chromas> It also mocks you if you drop the third slash
[23:29:39] <RandomFactor> s/challenged/impaired
[23:29:39] <SedBot> RindymFoctor, did you know there's THREE slashes in a proper s/// command?
[23:29:51] <RandomFactor> sedbot++
[23:29:51] <Bender> karma - sedbot: 6
[23:29:51] * SedBot is a 54-line awk script, https://github.com
[23:30:17] <requerdanos> there are not necessarily any slashes in a proper s command, however
[23:30:30] <chromas> s#x#y
[23:30:34] <chromas> s#x#y#
[23:30:34] <SedBot> <chromas> s#y#y
[23:30:39] <chromas> s#x#y
[23:30:46] <chromas> weird; I guess it only mocks if using slashes
[23:33:17] <requerdanos> Arguably, mentally adding / or /g might be preferable to mockery :)
[23:33:33] * RandomFactor disagrees
[23:33:40] <RandomFactor> mockery ftw
[23:34:16] <RandomFactor> Probably complicate the script
[23:34:38] <RandomFactor> Possibly https://raw.githubusercontent.com
[23:35:28] <RandomFactor> No mockery in that
[23:35:55] <requerdanos> I have a sneaky suspicion it might be https://github.com
[23:35:56] <systemd> ^ 03FoobarBazbot/sedbot
[23:36:09] <RandomFactor> awk matches
[23:36:39] <RandomFactor> mockery text matches. THink you pegged it
[23:37:51] <requerdanos> Right down to the hardcoded irc.sylnt.us/#soylent ?
[23:39:06] <Bytram> could well be; sedbot was one of the earlier bots I recall seeing heer
[23:39:17] <Bytram> s/eer/ere/
[23:39:17] <SedBot> <Bytram> could well be; sedbot was one of the earlier bots I recall seeing here
[23:39:31] <Bytram> :D
[23:43:51] <chromas> "No mockery in that"
[23:43:59] <chromas> except for the part where it's Python
[23:45:00] <RandomFactor> Meh, i don't know python and i know awk less.
[23:45:19] <RandomFactor> The world shoulda stopped with pascal dammit.
[23:45:50] <Bytram> Named after its authors, IIRC: Aho Weinberger and Kernigan
[23:46:43] <Bytram> AWK is small, fast, and amazing powerful.
[23:48:44] <RandomFactor> That...sounds like one of those 'pet names'
[23:50:27] <Bytram> I'm currently running Gnu Awk 5.1.0 and it is only 680,462 bytes. That's not a typo: bytes.
[23:50:47] <Bytram> =g awk
[23:50:48] <systemd> https://en.wikipedia.org - AWK - Wikipedia
[23:51:00] <Bytram> =g awk bird
[23:51:00] <systemd> https://en.wikipedia.org - Auk - Wikipedia
[23:51:34] <Bytram> there IS a difference... and I certainly would NOT want an Auk as a pet.
[23:51:54] <RandomFactor> Aukward
[23:51:55] * Bytram yawns
[23:51:55] * MrPlow flips a Skittle into Bytram's gaping mouth
[23:52:21] <RandomFactor> afk 10ish
[23:52:47] <Bytram> k